Vice

[sherri]

Originally Posted by Joneyee

Sarah Palin:

1. Currently Under Investiagation for Abuse of Power - hired a private attorney as of Yesterday.

2. Daughter is 17, pregnant and kepping the baby and intends to marry the father. There is widespread speculation that Gov. Palin's 2 year old baby actually belongs to her daughter as well. Hardly the picture of conservative america.

3. Gov. Palin was a member of the Alaskan Independence Party, prior to becoming a republican, a party that advocates Alaskan secession from the union.

Several members of the McCain campaign were heard saying Sunday that Sarah Palin was not who "John" wanted, that he wanted "Joe" or "Ridge" according to the NY Times.

Noone in the Alaskan State Legislature was contacted regarding Sarah Palin in any kind of vetting process.

The McCain vetting Team for Sarah Plain arrived in Alaska 3 days prior to the announcement of her nomination.

McCain offered her the job in their second meeting this year, their third ever lifetime (the one non-campaign meeting coming during a Governor's Covention a few years ago).

John McCain is trying to play to the disgruntled Hillary vote with this and it is sad that he felt it was appropriate to put this inexperienced woman a heartbeat from the Presidency in the event that his 73 year old ticker fails sometime in the next 4-8 years.

I'm not sure that's the kind of judgement that we can survive any more of.

Palins baby is 4 months, not 2 years. Since daughter is 5 months pregnant, she can't be the baby's mother.

Just my 2¢.

[Joneyee]

Originally Posted by sherri

Palins baby is 4 months, not 2 years. Since daughter is 5 months pregnant, she can't be the baby's mother.

Just my 2¢.

Thanks for the correction on the age, I was winging it from memory.

Here is the NYT article that i refered to a few times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us...se&oref=slogin

[pgreenbe305]

Originally Posted by Joneyee

Sarah Palin:

1. Currently Under Investiagation for Abuse of Power - hired a private attorney as of Yesterday.

2. Daughter is 17, pregnant and kepping the baby and intends to marry the father. There is widespread speculation that Gov. Palin's 2 year old baby actually belongs to her daughter as well. Hardly the picture of conservative america.

3. Gov. Palin was a member of the Alaskan Independence Party, prior to becoming a republican, a party that advocates Alaskan secession from the union.

Several members of the McCain campaign were heard saying Sunday that Sarah Palin was not who "John" wanted, that he wanted "Joe" or "Ridge" according to the NY Times.

Noone in the Alaskan State Legislature was contacted regarding Sarah Palin in any kind of vetting process.

The McCain vetting Team for Sarah Plain arrived in Alaska 3 days prior to the announcement of her nomination.

McCain offered her the job in their second meeting this year, their third ever lifetime (the one non-campaign meeting coming during a Governor's Covention a few years ago).

John McCain is trying to play to the disgruntled Hillary vote with this and it is sad that he felt it was appropriate to put this inexperienced woman a heartbeat from the Presidency in the event that his 73 year old ticker fails sometime in the next 4-8 years.

I'm not sure that's the kind of judgement that we can survive any more of.

Some of the stuff you quote is factual, some not, but please explain what experience Obama (or Biden) has to be President. I'm just not seeing how a Senator who has spent 143 days working in that position is ready to be a U.S. President. I'm not being a jerk, I'm really trying to get a good answer because every time I ask this question, all I hear is "we need change, and the country needs to go in a different direction," but that doesn't say how Obama is qualified. I'll say it again: I don't think any Senator or Congressman is qualified to be President, but in this battle of legislators, I think the one with more time "on the job" is more qualified, barely. Thank you for the spirited debate.

[sherri]

Originally Posted by Joneyee

Thanks for the correction on the age, I was winging it from memory.

Here is the NYT article that i refered to a few times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/us...se&oref=slogin

I read all the controversy. Does anyone really care that her husband had a dui 20 something years ago???

The fact she's for the schools teaching the "abstinence" method in health classes (oooops, mom?????) is a little scary, because we see how well that works!

[Joneyee]

Originally Posted by pgreenbe305

Some of the stuff you quote is factual, some not, but please explain what experience Obama (or Biden) has to be President. I'm just not seeing how a Senator who has spent 143 days working in that position is ready to be a U.S. President. I'm not being a jerk, I'm really trying to get a good answer because every time I ask this question, all I hear is "we need change, and the country needs to go in a different direction," but that doesn't say how Obama is qualified. I'll say it again: I don't think any Senator or Congressman is qualified to be President, but in this battle of legislators, I think the one with more time "on the job" is more qualified, barely. Thank you for the spirited debate.

Wow, someone targeted me, because I had facts on Sarah Palin, how quaint.

Joe Biden: 5th youngest Senator in U.S History when elected at the Constitutional minimum of age 30, has serveed in the U.S. Senate for 35 years (thats 12775 days if you are counting). Chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee. Not a mainstream Democrat, is just as much if not more of a maverick that Sen. McCain. U.S. Senate Committee on Foreign Relations is a standing committee of the United States Senate. It is charged with leading foreign-policy legislation and debate in the Senate. The Foreign Relations Committee is generally responsible for overseeing (but not administering) and funding foreign aid programs as well as funding, arms sales and training for national allies. The committee has considered, debated, and reported important treaties and legislation, ranging from the purchase of Alaska in 1867 to the establishment of the United Nations in 1945. It also holds jurisdiction over all diplomatic nominations.[1] Along with the Finance and Judiciary committees, the Foreign Relations Committee is one of the oldest in the Senate, going back to the initial creation of committees in 1816. Its "sister" committee in the U.S. House of Representatives is the United States House Committee on Foreign Affairs (renamed from International Relations by the 110th Congress in January 2007).

Barack Obama: Member of the U.S. Senate since 2004 (thats about 1340 days in office if you are counting by any math I know of). Prior to Serving in the U.S. Senate, he served in the Illinois Senate from 1997 to 2004. He is pro-choice, recognizes the 2nd amendment with respect to gun rights, has viable plans for improving healthcare and energy independence in this country (you can read them on his site, as an informed voter trying to make an important decision, I have). Has helped to create legislation on lobbying (who thinks lobbying is a good thing?), electoral fraud, terrorism, and climate change.

These are a small summary of my inferred opiniosn and much fact from preparing as a independent voter to vote in November. I don't know where my checkbox is going yet, but Sen. McCain's choice of Sarah Palin has made it very hard for me to, in good conscience, put him in office with the prospect of Gov. Palin as Vice president based on her experience of <2 years as Governor and as a small town mayor before that.


EDIT: Barack Obama's Tax plan will cut taxes for the lowest 80% of wage earners in this country. John McCain's will benefit the upper 15% while increasing the burden on the middle class, not my opinion, thats according to the Center for American Studies.

[rudeboy]

Originally Posted by fr4nk1yn

"Never talk politics or religion". But I have to ask
*SNIP*

QFT.... (10char)

[fr4nk1yn]

Being on my phone makes replying to different posts hard so I'll just pick one (:

Being inexperienced does not make one incompetent.
By that, and your own post, McCain would be incompetent.

Obama has chosen people who have run an epic campaign. If he chooses his cabinet the same we'll be in great shape.

That's the only hope I have for this election.
I'd be much happier if the "old McCain" was running I really that that guy.

[pgreenbe305]

Joneyee- I don't disagree that Sen. Biden isn't accomplished, but I don't think he's accomplished in the best career choice for an aspiring U.S. President (VP, in this case). A career legislator is a career legislator.

From a mathematical perspective- If you consider only the number of work days in the senate from the time of his election until he formed his presidential campaign, Obama served 144 days in the senate. McCain has served just under 2,000.

Again, I can't say that McCain is a great option, but now that he has someone who has "run something," balanced budgets, made on the spot decisions, he will get my vote.

Governors, mayors, and the like must make all decisions that they are presented with options for. Congressmen and Senators (state or U.S.) get to talk about, bring things on the floor, get lobbied, etc, prior to actually "doing something."

[Joneyee]

Originally Posted by pgreenbe305

Joneyee- I don't disagree that Sen. Biden isn't accomplished, but I don't think he's accomplished in the best career choice for an aspiring U.S. President (VP, in this case). A career legislator is a career legislator.

By that Logic, Sarah Palin is the most qualified, and that's idiocy - no offense

Originally Posted by pgreenbe305

From a mathematical perspective- If you consider only the number of work days in the senate from the time of his election until he formed his presidential campaign, Obama served 144 days in the senate. McCain has served just under 2,000.

I guess its a good thing the rest of the world doesn't count that way, or my boss with repsect to my pension, cause I would hate to have weekends and my two weeks of vacation, and my sick days counted against my tenure. But if it works for you in order to make a quizzical, non-importnat point regarding the amount of time politicians spend on the job, good for you. I simply don't subscribe to creative rhetoric that is at its base meaningless. Facts are more important to me.

Originally Posted by pgreenbe305

Again, I can't say that McCain is a great option, but now that he has someone who has "run something," balanced budgets, made on the spot decisions, he will get my vote.

Name a Budget, under a Republican Executive, that McCain has balanced. Do you mean all by his lone-some, your own point regarding legislators vs executives undercuts this argument.

Originally Posted by pgreenbe305

Governors, mayors, and the like must make all decisions that they are presented with options for. Congressmen and Senators (state or U.S.) get to talk about, bring things on the floor, get lobbied, etc, prior to actually "doing something."

If you dont think Executives get lobbied, please see Dick Cheny's bonus when he left Halliburton prior to assuming the chase for the white house. He had several million in his back pocket from big oil before he was selected to set the country's energy policy.

[pgreenbe305]

Originally Posted by Joneyee

By that Logic, Sarah Palin is the most qualified, and that's idiocy - no offense

Correct- in the job they're vying for- she is the most qualified, not Obama, Biden, or McCain- no offense.


I guess its a good thing the rest of the world doesn't count that way, or my boss with repsect to my pension, cause I would hate to have weekends and my two weeks of vacation, and my sick days counted against my tenure. But if it works for you in order to make a quizzical, non-importnat point regarding the amount of time politicians spend on the job, good for you. I simply don't subscribe to creative rhetoric that is at its base meaningless. Facts are more important to me.

It's factual that's how many days he's spent "working" as a Senator. I don't pay my employees for weekends, days off, etc. If you're looking at time on the job, and apply the same calculation to McCain's civil service, it is far greater- even though I'm not convinced that he's fit for the job either.

Name a Budget, under a Republican Executive, that McCain has balanced. Do you mean all by his lone-some, your own point regarding legislators vs executives undercuts this argument.

McCain has never balanced a budget either. Don't mix my words up- I think both tickets suck, but the Republican one now has some executive experience, which cannot be disputed. 1.5 years as a Governor is more executive experience than a lifetime in the Senate... 2 totally different jobs.

If you dont think Executives get lobbied, please see Dick Cheny's bonus when he left Halliburton prior to assuming the chase for the white house. He had several million in his back pocket from big oil before he was selected to set the country's energy policy.

I'm plenty sure executives get lobbied, but it's true that Administrator/ Executive positions must make on the spot decisions which lawmakers simply don't. Also, I don't care to talk about Halliburton or any other company (public or private) that any politicians have worked for. I personally feel it's pointless to discuss "possible" buy offs. Unfortunately, many are guilty of it, but we could have a life long discussion on everyone and their possible "buy offs"- regardless of the party. Again... unfortunately. My point was not about politicians getting lobbied, but more over on how the decision making process differs between legislator and President.

If someone thinks Barrack will make a better leader/ executive branch chief, they should definitely vote for him, but that's why there are more parties because I simply don't see how Obama (who has had little/ no job experience) is going to be better than someone who has had more experience. Again, neither have the experience that I feel is imperative to running a country, but at this point- I feel the Republican ticket does, barely, by adding a former Governor (and mayor, city council leader, etc). I'm now extremely tired and my fingers are over typing about politics, so that's my last post, but I wish you luck in whoever you choose to support, just as I'm sure we'll all need it regardless of who wins the election.